Why I won't be buying a Hybrid car

[Dardedar]

DOUG
Hence no pictures of a person with the Pukka..?

DAR
Person on a pukka.



Looks better with small people.

Hey SAV, if I up load pictures to some internet site (photobucket.com etc) would I be able to easily link to them you think?

I have a good picture of me herding my goats with my pukka. Not something you see everyday.

D.

[Tamara]

Did I hear someone say they wanted to see Darrel herding goats on his pukka?

[Savonarola]

Hey SAV, if I up load pictures to some internet site (photobucket.com etc) would I be able to easily link to them you think?

To all: As long as that internet site hasn't disabled remote linking, this would work just fine.
To Darrel: You can always upload to the fayfreethinkers.com images directory.

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

Doug, is the Cree actually available & "street legal" in the US? Also, how much is it?

[Doug]

Doug, is the Cree actually available & "street legal" in the US? Also, how much is it?

DOUG
The Cree is not available. The Department of Transportation will not allow into the US any electric car that goes more than 25mph. They will not say why. The Cree and the Twike (see below) are classified as motorcycles, so they don't have to pass the same safety tests as a car. So it is not a safety issue.

The Twike is available in Europe. It is 100% electric (7000 watts of power available), and it can come with or without pedals. The pedals are for recharging the battery, not for motion.

It has a top speed of about 55 mph, and a range of about 80 miles. With two people pedaling hard, the range can be increased by 50%.





The Twike is my dream car!

[Guest]

"Imports in" - does that mean only EV imports are blocked at the +25 mph or does that mean anyone who buys or converts a domestic vehicle into something that does hwy speeds is also doing something illegal? If so, that explains why nobody's heard any more of the shade tree mechanics in WV who were converting Chevy S-10s into EVs that did 70 mph (200 mile range, max) using 16 linked batteries - I read an article in Mother Earth News on them about 8 years ago. Be interesting to know what their rationale is (can't fight a shadow, but a specific should be easy meat).

[Doug]

"Imports in" - does that mean only EV imports are blocked at the +25 mph or does that mean anyone who buys or converts a domestic vehicle into something that does hwy speeds is also doing something illegal?

DOUG
You can convert existing cars to electric, and get them to do highway speeds, and there is no legal problem. In fact, our own webmaster has done exactly that.

But no imports.

The US company Corbin Motors had a really nice electric commuter one-person car, the Sparrow, that could do 60+ mph, with a 20-40 mile range between charges. But infighting in the company sunk it, and they are on permanent hiatus. Their Sparrow (below) looks cool!

If so, that explains why nobody's heard any more of the shade tree mechanics in WV who were converting Chevy S-10s into EVs that did 70 mph (200 mile range, max) using 16 linked batteries - I read an article in Mother Earth News on them about 8 years ago. Be interesting to know what their rationale is (can't fight a shadow, but a specific should be easy meat).

DOUG
The shade tree mechanics must have lost interest or something.

You can buy gas-to-electric conversions from Zapworld here:

http://www.zapworld.com/cars/salecars.asp

They even have some used Sparrows for $16,000 or so.

[Savonarola]

If so, that explains why nobody's heard any more of the shade tree mechanics in WV who were converting Chevy S-10s into EVs that did 70 mph (200 mile range, max) using 16 linked batteries - I read an article in Mother Earth News on them about 8 years ago.

Our conversion is a Mazda B2200 which is similar in size to an S-10 (which, coincidentally, was our original choice). It runs on a 120VDC system (20 batteries x 6V apiece). The half ton (literally!) of batteries makes it a bit sluggish. We've had it up to 65 before and have no doubt that it can go a bit faster. Its range, however is more limited, around 50 miles per charge.

A larger problem might be finding an insurance company to insure it, as all vehicles are required to be insured. Fortunately, even our mom-and-pop insurance people had no problem, except for wanting to see it beforehand.

[Doug]

Here's a link to the Electric Auto Association.

http://www.eaaev.org/

Here's an electric car from Norway, the Kewet Buddy.



Motor: SepEx 72V DC, 12 kW
Top speed: 80-90 km/h depending of battery technology
Acceleration: 0-50 km/h in 7 seconds
Brakes: Regenerative braking to enhance the driving range. Disc brakes on all wheels with double circuit braking system. Parking brake on the rear wheels.
Batteries: Maintenance-free lead batteries, ca 8.4 kWh or optional ca 10.5 kWh available / Safe Li-Ion technology, ca 7.2 kWh or optional ca 14.4 kWh available
Charging time: 0-100% in 6-8 hours, 30-100% in 3 hours
Range: Lead-acid batteries 50-100 km, depending on road conditions,
temperature and the driver / Li-Ion batteries up to 150 km

[Doug]

DOUG
The world-famous catalog company, Hammacher-Schlemmer, is selling a velomobile that is basically a Go-One.

You can read about it here.
http://www.hammacher.com/publish/10942. ... mo=QSearch

They are calling it a "Velocipede." $13,999.95 Allow 4-6 weeks for delivery.



Of course, you could instead have the Levitating Hover Scooter for $16,999.95. It goes up to 15mph.

[Doug]

DOUG
A Japanese company has this electric motorcycle coming out. It was shown on CNN with a rider and it looks really cool. The bucket seat look kind of unusual.




Japanese electric vehicle manufacturer Axle unveils a new electric motorcycle EV-X7 powered by new hybrid magnetic motor SUMO, developed with its partner company Genesis Corp. in Tokyo April 4, 2006. The magnetic motor - a hybrid of a electromagnet and a permanent magnet - greatly enhances energy efficiency and allows the electric motorcycle to travel up to 180 kilometres (112 miles) on one charge, the makers said. REUTERS/Toshiyuki Aizawa

http://www.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf

Another picture:

[Doug]

Meet the 200-mph Electric Car By Christopher Palmeri

Christopher Palmeri

A fledging Las Vegas-based company called Hybrid Technologies thinks it has the solution. Hybrid will launch a car it calls LiX-75 at the New York Auto Show on Apr.14. The sleek, $125,000 sports car runs off of electric batteries, boosted by solar panels on the trunk. It recharges in four to six hours from a regular three-prong electric socket. And the company claims it will go from zero to 60 miles per hour in three seconds and hit a top speed of 200 miles per hour.

LINK

I couldn't find a picture of it. Probably next week one will be available.

Edited by Savonarola 09Apr2006 2218: Shortened link

[Barbara Fitzpatrick]

Anybody have any information on safety issues with hybrid and electric cars? A friend just told me she'd heard (from an EMT friend of her husband) that in case of an accident, electricity runs through the doors and if the EMTs don't have special ceramic "jaws of life" equipment to get the doors open, both ETMs and vehicle inhabitants can be killed just trying to get them out. I'd like verification or debunking - it sounds like the kind of thing that gets spread by "traditional" auto industry to keep people from buying hybrids, but I need facts to give my friend.

[Doug]

Anybody have any information on safety issues with hybrid and electric cars? A friend just told me she'd heard (from an EMT friend of her husband) that in case of an accident, electricity runs through the doors and if the EMTs don't have special ceramic "jaws of life" equipment to get the doors open, both ETMs and vehicle inhabitants can be killed just trying to get them out. I'd like verification or debunking - it sounds like the kind of thing that gets spread by "traditional" auto industry to keep people from buying hybrids, but I need facts to give my friend.

DOUG
It sounds like a lot of bull. I don't see any reason to think that this would be any more of a problem on an electric car than on any other car. In any case, the EMT's could just disconnect the battery, couldn't they?

[Savonarola]

A friend just told me she'd heard (from an EMT friend of her husband) that in case of an accident, electricity runs through the doors and if the EMTs don't have special ceramic "jaws of life" equipment to get the doors open, both ETMs and vehicle inhabitants can be killed just trying to get them out.

Unlike the "floating ground" system in use on most cars today (where the cathode of the 12V battery is connected to the chassis), high voltage systems are usually self-contained.

With the exception of the short pieces under the hood, the high voltage cables in my conversion not only have the standard insulation but also protective plastic pipe that we added. We also implemented a circuit breaker; in case of a short circuit, the connection through the contactor will automatically be severed. (It also functions as an "emergency off" switch, though we've never had to use it that way.) This is neither difficult nor novel, and in my opinion should be a common component of commercial EVs.

But of course, the main thing to keep in mind is that electricity will not flow without a complete circuit. Even if one side of the high-voltage system got shorted to the chassis, there ought not be any danger unless the Jaws of Life operator decides to grab onto the other electrode for leverage...

[Dardedar]

DOUG
It sounds like a lot of bull. I don't see any reason to think that this would be any more of a problem on an electric car than on any other car. In any case, the EMT's could just disconnect the battery, couldn't they?

DAR
Well there is the concern that an EV car's battery is storing a massive amount of energy so it needs to be able to withstand a highspeed crash without spraying acid on everyone (if it uses a lead acid battery technology) or explode. This is of course very much taken into consideration and prepared for. Most of these batteries don't use a liquid (for instance). The problem put forward by Barbara's friend is baseless and I think Sav answered it well enough. For one thing, these cars of the future should have more and more polycarbonate plastic rather than steel. Any kind of EV put out by a car manufacturor (rather than a home hobbiest) would definitely have all sorts of protections against shorting anywhere near the passengers along with multiple levels of redundant safety systems. We have been playing with electricity, and even electric cars, for well over a hundred years now. I am not saying you won't have the odd one mess up because of being made wrong or human error, but comparatively speaking, electric cars should catch on fire and blow up far less than their gas counterparts.
Just last week there was a car on the bypass pulled over with it's engine on fire.

D.

[Savonarola]

For one thing, these cars of the future should have more and more polycarbonate plastic rather than steel.

The steel is needed for structural integrity in the case of a crash. And as long as large amounts of metal are used, myths like this one may remain prevalent.

[Betsy]

http://www.dailysixer.com/sphybrid.shtml


here's a clip from a South Park episode about hybrids...

[Dardedar]

http://www.dailysixer.com/sphybrid.shtml


here's a clip from a South Park episode about hybrids...

DAR
I do the same thing, except I do it on my Pukka. 1000 mpg.

I saw you the other day on your scooter at the crossover/45 intersection. I tooted my horn but you were daydreaming.

D.

[Doug]

From the Twike.us website:
"We are preparing to import the first new TWIKEs to the USA in the spring of 2006."